No regret, no shame

KALYAN SINGH, who as the BJP Chief Minister of Uttar Pradesh presided over the demolition of the Babri Masjid on December 6, 1992, feels no remorse for his act and remains steadfast in his resolve to work for the construction of a grand Ram temple in Ayodhya. He was expelled from the party in 1999, but returned in 2004, only to resign in 2009 ahead of the Lok Sabha elections. He is clearly raring to return to the party and revive the Ram temple issue because he believes this can take the party once again to the pinnacle of power. He said the Liberhan Commission report could work as sanjivani (a life-giving herb) for the gasping BJP. Excerpts from the interview:

The Liberhan report categorically indicts you for creating a situation that could have resulted in nothing else but the demolition. It says you lied to the highest authorities, befooled them with constitutional niceties in order to tie their hands and supported the destruction of the mosque with tacit, open and active material support. In short, you planned and conspired for the demolition of the mosque.

It is absolutely wrong to say that there was any planning or conspiracy to demolish the structure. What happened that day was an unexpected and unplanned outburst of the crushed feelings of crores of Hindus for four centuries. There was no planning, and this is borne out by the fact that senior BJP and RSS leaders such as Advaniji, [Murli Manohar] Joshi, Uma Bharati, H.V. Sheshadri [VHP leader], Ashok Singhal [VHP leader] and others were present on the stage that day. They could have avoided their presence if there was a conspiracy. The fact that they were present should make even the most naive realise that there was no conspiracy or planning.

But being the Chief Minister you were entrusted with the responsibility of protecting the mosque. You gave an undertaking to the Supreme Court and the National Integration Council. Still you did nothing when the mosque was being demolished despite the presence there of police personnel to guard the mosque. How do you justify that?

Yes, true I had given an undertaking that I would protect the structure. I tried my best to protect it. When people started climbing atop the domes I gave the police instructions to stop that and use any and every force, I repeat any and every force, except firing to stop them. But there was such frenzy, there was such junoon [frenzy], that it became impossible to stop people once they pushed ahead. The administration tried its best to prevent the demolition but the structure could not be saved. It was an old structure and once people climbed atop and started hammering away, it gave in and crumbled.

But why not firing? After all it was a matter of protecting the countrys secular fabric, reinforcing the rule of law and respecting the Constitution? Mulayam Singh Yadav as Chief Minister ordered firing in October-November 1990 and this helped save the mosque.

I had given specific instructions to the police not to open fire. There were thousands of kar sevaks at that time and firing would have resulted in a massacre. Thousands would have died in the firing and stampede. I also realised that there was such junoon among the kar sevaks that even if firing had been ordered the structure could not have been saved. It would have fallen anyway. At that time I was faced with two choices, either try and protect the structure, which was doubtful, or save the lives of thousands of kar sevaks. I opted for the lives of kar sevaks. The structure in any case was a blot on our culture. It was not built by Babar out of great respect for Islam or to offer namaaz, but to insult and humiliate lakhs of Hindus. It was a result of the vicarious pleasure he derived after building a mosque over the debris of a temple. I am happy that by taking the right decision I was able to save the lives of thousands of kar sevaks that day.

But do you not regret that if you had been more careful, if you had prevented the gathering of so many people well before time, the mosque would still have been there and the countrys secular fabric would not have been irretrievably damaged? Do you not hold yourself responsible for one of the biggest shames in our country?

I have no regret, no repentance, no sorrow, no grief and no shame. True, I gave in writing to the Supreme Court and the NIC [National Integration Council] that I would protect the structure, and I tried my best. But I am not guilty of demolishing it. It happened as an accident. Accidents happen all the time despite the best security arrangements. Indira Gandhi was killed despite one of the best security arrangements for her. Rajiv Gandhi was killed. Was there a lack of security for him? I dont think whatever happened that day was a shame. In fact, the structure was a shame for all of us. Good that it is gone now. Not that I planned to demolish it, but I dont regret its demolition either.

But the fact that you did not deploy Central forces and rather prevented their movement once trouble broke out makes you guilty of abetting in the act.

If any action of mine contributed to the demolition, I am proud of having done my bit for the Ram temple. My life is committed to building a grand Ram temple at that spot. As for deployment of Central forces, the Centre did not even inform me that it was sending these forces. It stationed the forces at the railway station because that was Central government property. I was not even informed.

Do you think this report will once again revive the Ram Mandir issue, which had almost vanished from the political discourse?

If the BJP plays its card smartly, the Liberhan report can act as a sanjivani for it. But it will have to link the temple issue with issues relating to the deprived sections of society, poor farmers, women and those who have been left behind in the rat race. Then it can work wonders for the party.

You are saying it in a way as if you have already chalked out your plan for reviving the BJP with the help of this issue. Is your return to the BJP on the anvil?

I would not know that but I am one who combines the success formula of both Mandal and kamandal, and I can still mobilise the masses on the basis of these two issues. People still believe me when I speak on the temple issue. I am firmly of the opinion that the BJP can revive itself by taking recourse to this issue, and I would be more than willing to give a helping hand. If my departure from the BJP had damaged its prospects in any way I am willing to compensate for that. The BJP still has its ground in Uttar Pradesh, it only needs to water it a bit and add some fertilizer, and the ground will be ready to be harvested once again.

The report has totally absolved the Central government of any role in the demolition. Do you think that is politically motivated?

The report is totally politically motivated. The demolition was a result of the acts of successive Central governments. After all, who allowed the unlocking of the structure in 1986, who allowed shilanyas in 1989, who allowed the idols to be kept there in 1949? It was [in each instance] the then Central government. The Central government was fully responsible for the demolition and a clean chit to it and the indictment of only BJP-RSS leaders show the report is biased and prejudiced.

Do you think this report can change the political course in the country as it has talked about the grave implications of associating religion with politics, of politically influencing the police force, etc., and suggested remedies?

This report is fit to be dumped in the dustbin. Who is Liberhan to suggest what course politics should take in this country? It is not his brief.